View Issue Details
|ID||Project||Category||View Status||Date Submitted||Last Update|
|0000647||madVR||bug||public||2020-06-26 19:29||2020-12-11 19:54|
|Summary||0000647: mpc be madvr hdr passthrough does not work anymore|
|Description||since nvidia changed the hdr code and/or hdr handling in 45x.xx driver branch madvr hdr passthrough does not work anymore.|
instead of passthroughing hdr to the display madvr activates windows hdr and sends sdr to display.
|Steps To Reproduce||install 45x.xx.|
activate hdr passthrough to display in madvr.
install mpc be and set madvr as renderer.
start a hdr mkv for example.
windows hdr will be activated and sdr movie will appear.
|Tags||No tags attached.|
|Media Player (with version info)||MPC-BE.126.96.36.19969.x64|
|Splitter (with version info)||-|
|Decoder (with version info)||-|
|DXVA2 Scaling Active||<select>|
|Aero / Desktop Composition||<select>|
|Problem occurs with mode||all modes|
|GPU Model||rtx 2080|
|GPU Driver Version||issue is with 45x.xx branch. last working is 446.14.|
||problem is in new 451.67 whql still present.|
It appears I am now at a point where I have to update the driver purely to keep on top of my games. madshi, do you know what they did to the API? Is it entirely new code?
same problem here!
when activating win 10 desktop HDR madVR uses OS HDR instead of NV HDR and everything is fine. is there any way to tell madVR to always use OS HDR without enabling/disabling it all the time?
not same problem there since when you do it right like i described and like how everybody uses it currently madvr since 45x.xx always autoactivates os hdr instead of nv hdr and the movie is still washed out sdr.
what you call the solution and are asking for is the damn problem we have.
madvr hdr passthrough is build so nobody needs the disgusting os hdr and for auto activating/deactivating nv hdr at start/close of movie.
btw @ madshi: did you look into that? can you change something and make hdr passthrough work again with 45x.xx?
this would be very nice because as we speak people research on dolby vision mkvs.
makemkv for example just added the new matroska 1.6.0 specs for storing dv metadata in mkv.
dolby vision mkvs already work when build with makemkv 1.15.2 and played back by a modified exoplayer apk in kodi!
having working madvr hdr and later on dolby viosion passthrough with 45x.xx+ would be gold.
please tell us the current status.
ok sorry, that's weird B1gD4ddy.
i just tested it with the latest nvidia drivers (gtx1660 super):
win10 HDR enabled: madvr uses OS HDR & fullscreen windowed and everything works perfectly fine
win10 HDR disabled: madvr uses NV HDR & fullscreen exclusive and HDR is washed out although my display goes to HDR mode
yes, when you manually activate win hdr and then start the movie everything works fine.
but when win hdr is turned off and you start the movie and let madvr turn on hdr on its own then it turns on win hdr automatically but movie is still washed out sdr.
but manually activating win hdr everytime before you start a movie is no solution, since we use the madvr hdr passthrough feature for the very reason that it automatically turns on nv hdr when you start the movie and it turns off nv hdr automatically when you close the player. win hdr had never to be touched. it always worked that way until nvidia released 45x.xx.
Whilst we're waiting I have set up an AutoHotKey that toggles Windows HDR on/off by pressing a button. That button is mapped to a key on my remote so that all I have to do is use my Logitech Harmony (start Kodi > press button to toggle HDR > play movie > press button to automatically turn off HDR).
Not as convenient as madVR auto-switching but much better than manually having to fiddle with settings every time.
can confirm this behavior too.
I hope madshi can find some time beside his big hardware project to keep the original source alive and properly working. please check this problem.
thank you so much.
I was just trying to find out if other people have same issues in other forums and I am wondering why there are not more people noticing the same.
I thought MadVR is THE one and only filter out there to get the best HDR experience on a PC. MadVR is mentioned everywhere but nevertheless we have almost no reaction on this issue?
Is there a workaround? Or any config item I do not see?
This bug report is "assigned" which means I plan to work on it, when I find the time.
Please note that I've *always* recommended to users to stick to Windows 8.1, where you wouldn't have this problem. Also, you could go back to 44x.xx drivers where you also wouldn't have this problem. Also, you could complain to Nvidia for breaking what was once working. It's not a bug in madVR that this doesn't work, anymore. It's Nvidia's fault, they *intentionally* broke the API that madVR (and several games) have been using for years.
IMHO what Nvidia did was bad, not just because they broke a nicely working solution, but also because the new solution they implemented IMHO completely sucks. They got the OS involved, and I fear (although I'll have to double check to be 100% sure) that this will result in the HDR output not being lossless, any longer. With 44x.xx drivers and the old API madVR was able to achieve perfectly lossless output quality. Every bit output via HDMI was fully defined by madVR and not modified by Nvidia drivers or the OS behind madVR's back. I assume that with 45x.xx drivers this will no longer be the case. Which could potentially hurt image quality. But, as I said, I'll have to double check to be sure.
thank you. would love to hear back from you.
the current workaround is to manually activate winhdr and then start the movie with mpc be madvr hdr passthrough.
do you think that is losless or not?
||Most likely not.|
but dont want to annoy you any longer.
would just love to hear back from you in the future when you had time to analyze that more.
madshi, not wanting to add fuel to the fire but it appears Nvidia are playing the blame game:
According to their rep it is an app bug (yours?) and that a workaround will be provided with the next driver. Perhaps you don't need to do anything after all?
Haha, sure, it's all my fault. :-D Not.
Nvidia did contact me, they said they changed the way their API works, but that it should still work fine in FSE mode. And I could make it work for windowed mode, as well, by calling some additional APIs.
So yes, I should be able to make it work, by adding more code. But it's a change in API behaviour that Nvidia requires me to do now which wasn't necessary before.
Plus, I was being told that everything should still work fine in FSE mode. Seems that's not the case?
Plus, I fear that the new solution may no longer be lossless, but I can't be 100% sure about that because I haven't tested it yet.
Thank you to react! Please understand, there is nothing else than a windows 10 pc as the main center of my multimedia rig anymore. I am directly depending on such problems like HDR Passthrough throuhg Nvidia GFX card to my 75" tv. .
I have no clue how to interact with nvidia in such matters but believe me I need full passthrough through windows 10 and nvidia GFX card with latest GFX Driver at all times..
how can I help you ?
Can we add some AI and Cloud computing to it and use agile mthodology (not) ?
Sorry.. sometimes I am tired of IT..
I just tested the FSE Mode again but I have the same behavior. HDR Mode is not switched on automatically. I have Nvidia Driver 452.06 installed.
What my setup always does when I start a Movie, it switches to 23Hz. (TV turns black for 2 Secs in FSE and Normal Mode, and during that switch HDR was also turned on.
what ever it is worth games don't really care about the driver version and HDR work with them.
the only game i tested that nearly for sure uses the nvidia API has some special needs to enter HDR mode.
it only uses FSE at all times and the image(windows desktop) get's totally disrupted when you tab or anything. so i wanted to test the only FSE mode from MPC-HC but that option has been removed for madVR.
i can later try a different game that may uses the nvidia API but that game doesn't even have finished HDR support...
good and bad news guys.
nvidia stated in changelog of new driver 456.38 that they fixed the issue.
[madVR][MPC-HC]: Various HDR issues occur when using the madVR renderer with MPC-HC. 
but thats only halftrue, in fact they added more annoying things.
while it is true that when you now start a movie via mpc-be madvr hdr passthrough windows hdr indeed keeps being turned off, but hdr is still applied to the whole screen instead of only to the player.
that leads to the problem that as long as the player is windowed it shows washed out sdr. you have to make the player fullscreen so that you finally see hdr.
next very very annoying bugs that got added in this new driver are
1. when you touch the scroolbar of the player to jump through the video the video turns washed out sdr. you have to leave the scroolbar and put the cursor back on the video to make it hdr again.
2. whenever you window/fullscreen the player or resize the player the whole screen flickers atleast 2 times.
3. sometimes when closing the player the screen keeps being extremely brightend up.
tldr: bug: hdr is applied to hole screen instead of only the video player which makes the video washed out sdr until fullscreened + the 3 new problems i described.
> but hdr is still applied to the whole screen instead of only to the player
But that was always this way in 44x.xx drivers (and older)! Or is it different now compared to 44x.xx drivers?
(the scrollbar and flickering things are new, of course)
no, it was just perfect.
you start a movie and tv insta activates hdr and the complete screen is brightend up and player shows washed out sdr. you have to go fullscreen to see hdr. plus the problems 2 and 3
you start a movie and tv does not turn on hdr, everything is normal and fine and player shows sdr not washed out sdr. when you go fullscreen tv activates hdr and turns it off when you close player or go windowed.
btw i now also have the scrollbar problem with 446.14...odd, did my memory fool me or is it a windows 20h2 problem? i dont remember havin problem 1 ever.
||Ok, I'll have a look at 45x.xx some point "soon". Soon means could be weeks... :-(|
||I suppose the above is a non-issue for me since I set up mpc-BE to always start in fullscreen as an external player in Kodi, meaning it used to activate HDR the moment I pressed play for as long as I remember.|
still problem 1 and 3 and maybe the flickering of 2
i only have the "issue" of 3. that it takes a sec or longer to leave HDR mode when the player is closed.
i have a delay when switching between full screen and windowed but nothing major windowed HDR works totally fine here to even through the windows desktop is over saturated
my 3 is that it stays ultra bright.
yes windows desktop is over saturated since hdr is applied to the whole screen, no matter if player is full screen or a little window, unfortunately
you have no hdr turnoff when using or hovering over scrollbar of player when in fullscreen hdr movie with 456.38?
and no screen flickering when resizing player with 456.38?
||no none of that but i'm using overlay rendering.|
indeed very special behavior:
(not using FSE:)
when I start a HDR movie my TV switches into HDR Mode although windows is not switched automatically to HDR mode (before windows always fully switches to HDR)
Desktop colors seem to be oversaturated little bit but this is because the frequency changes to 23Hz I thinks.
When I go fullscreen with MPC BE the HDR seems to be correct and when I move the cursor down the slider appears and the movie goes back to SDR washed out.
So it seems the player makes an isolated HDR pass through not touching the Windows setting and my TV recognizes the HDR Stream directly from the player. As soon as a windows overlay jumps in the setting does not apply anymore and uses the windows setting (no HDR Mode)
that is indeed very new.. For me it is till not clear how I should use HDR on a windows PC. Movies and Games should switch my TV to HDR when started like before?
Or can I always switch HDR Mode on?
I'd love to leave windows always in HDR mode but the OS seems still not to be designed to have a beautiful HDR Surface..
So what does the Windows HDR mode stand for anyhow?
did you read my last posts?
you experience the exact same 456.38 behavior as i do and don't forget the 2time flickering i described.
and i noticed when i go back to 446.14 i still have the touch-slider-hdr-gone-thing.
i don't remember having this when 446.14 was current. do you?
maybe a win 20h2 problem?!
Not entirely shure if this is related: I got NV HDR working with MadVR 0.92.17 and driver 452.06 by right clicking the .exe of MPC-HC and PotPlayer -> Properties -> Compatibility -> and checking "Disable fullscreen optimization". Now the faded colors disappear when I enter exclusive fullscreen mode. Worked for both players.
we already have nv hdr fullscreen working since win hdr is turned off and keeps being turned off when starting a movie with madvr hdr passthrough and 456.38.
that never was a problem.
but we have alllll the other problems i listed.
btw i started a thread in geforce forum, got insta 3 downvotes and got told im too dumb to use madvr...oh the humanity...deleted the thread in this cancer forum again.
maybe someone else wants to try.
||I recall when using madvr for the first time around April 2019 that any change from fullscreen (windowed or activating OSD) would disable HDR passthrough and change the colors and switching out of HDR caused the screen to blink. There was some driver change that I can't pinpoint where HDR passed through at all times.|
Sorry for late reply.
@B1gD4ddy: unfortunately I cannot remember when exactly the issue started. I did not check after all windows and updates carefully enough.
At the moment with 4Nvidia 457.30 and Windows 20H2 OS build 19042.630 everything seems to be working. Windows however does not switch to HDR Mode anymore and when I touch the slider the Player switches from HDR to SDR. So far I can live very well with this.
However please allow me to mention the following on my current odyssey to hit the perfect screen refresh rate of 23.976Hz for my mkv files, which in the end actually even confused me much more. I was not sure anymore about if the player is really sending 10bit HDR content to my Samsung 10bit Panel or not:
When I checked the Overlay Information of my player I noticed that my display is almost at 23.976Hz but only > (8bit, RGB, full)
Further in fullscreen the next output information was displaying D3D11 windowed fullscreen (8bit)
so all this confused me even more (madVR is REALLY doing a superb job regardless if you use HDR or the HDR simulation on SDR, the difference is not obvious) and I started to mess around with the settings again to head for REAL 10bit HDR output with following conclusion:
It is out of a sudden possible to switch Nvidia Driver to 23Hz AND 12bit(!) output color depth, while color format is RGB and output dynamic range is Full. And when the player switches to 23Hz the color depth remains at 12bit (!?) Is this new or was I just sleeping?
the D3D11 output in my app chain (MPC BE, LAV Filters, madVR) can obviously only be set to REAL 10bit output if I disable the ThumbNailPreview Service for Icons in the Windows Explorer View Setting. This Service is obviously producing a windows layer over the player that lets it stick to 8bit (and yes this holy crap I only figured out by using the thankful debug mode.)
So only now I am really sure that my setup outputs 10bit HDR content to the Samsung Panel.
My only issues for now is I have still some juddering when I activate the Smooth Motion in the Samsung Options. I still dont get it how I setup the perfect 23.976Hz. (tried CRU utility, Windows Custom Resolution)In fast motion pictures I have judders and blurs and small black and white detailed patterns are starting to flicker badly.
It is clear that the Smooth Motion Option has issues with this, but I think the root cause is based on this unbelievably complicated pull down between frames and frequency.
That mess is hopefully finally soon resolved with the new worldwide standardized and harmonized media presenting technologies ((I forgot the name of this new Master Film Studio Standard)
So to cut a long story short: for me its almost everything perfect, I believe I really get what my hardware is supposed to be delivering.
Looking forward to 4k120Hz, replacing again GFX Card, AV Receiver and TV ;-) and thanks again to madshis superb work.
|2020-06-26 19:29||B1gD4ddy||New Issue|
|2020-06-26 23:47||madshi||Assigned To||=> madshi|
|2020-06-26 23:47||madshi||Status||new => assigned|
|2020-07-09 22:59||B1gD4ddy||Note Added: 0002711|
|2020-07-19 12:19||Cineaste||Note Added: 0002714|
|2020-07-19 15:19||Cineaste||Note Edited: 0002714|
|2020-07-27 15:32||zeus0r||Note Added: 0002718|
|2020-07-27 16:10||B1gD4ddy||Note Added: 0002719|
|2020-07-27 17:42||B1gD4ddy||Note Edited: 0002719|
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|2020-07-27 18:02||B1gD4ddy||Note Added: 0002720|
|2020-07-27 18:10||B1gD4ddy||Note Edited: 0002720|
|2020-07-27 18:10||B1gD4ddy||Note Edited: 0002720|
|2020-07-28 20:16||zeus0r||Note Added: 0002721|
|2020-07-28 20:34||B1gD4ddy||Note Added: 0002722|
|2020-07-28 20:36||B1gD4ddy||Note Edited: 0002722|
|2020-07-30 06:59||Cineaste||Note Added: 0002724|
|2020-07-31 22:32||cccleaner||Note Added: 0002725|
|2020-08-15 17:40||cccleaner||Note Added: 0002731|
|2020-08-25 17:14||B1gD4ddy||Note Added: 0002735|
|2020-08-25 19:37||madshi||Note Added: 0002736|
|2020-08-25 20:42||B1gD4ddy||Note Added: 0002737|
|2020-08-25 20:44||B1gD4ddy||Note Edited: 0002737|
|2020-08-25 20:46||madshi||Note Added: 0002738|
|2020-08-25 20:48||B1gD4ddy||Note Added: 0002739|
|2020-08-26 06:32||Cineaste||Note Added: 0002740|
|2020-08-26 10:28||madshi||Note Added: 0002741|
|2020-08-26 19:17||cccleaner||Note Added: 0002742|
|2020-08-28 17:58||cccleaner||Note Added: 0002743|
|2020-09-01 00:08||huhn||Note Added: 0002744|
|2020-09-17 15:31||B1gD4ddy||Note Added: 0002745|
|2020-09-17 15:34||B1gD4ddy||Note Edited: 0002745|
|2020-09-17 15:36||madshi||Note Added: 0002746|
|2020-09-17 15:37||B1gD4ddy||Note Edited: 0002745|
|2020-09-17 15:57||B1gD4ddy||Note Added: 0002747|
|2020-09-17 16:03||madshi||Note Added: 0002748|
|2020-09-17 16:04||B1gD4ddy||Note Edited: 0002747|
|2020-09-17 16:20||Cineaste||Note Added: 0002749|
|2020-09-17 16:25||B1gD4ddy||Note Added: 0002750|
|2020-09-17 16:26||B1gD4ddy||Note Edited: 0002750|
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|2020-09-17 20:32||huhn||Note Added: 0002753|
|2020-09-18 16:45||cccleaner||Note Added: 0002754|
|2020-09-19 08:49||B1gD4ddy||Note Added: 0002755|
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|2020-09-19 16:42||ParadoxDelta||Note Added: 0002756|
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|2020-09-19 16:53||B1gD4ddy||Note Added: 0002757|
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|2020-09-20 15:35||cobravision||Note Added: 0002758|
|2020-11-24 14:25||cccleaner||Note Added: 0002759|